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Cost of wraith lord

 Post subject: Cost of wraith lord
PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2016 8:51 am 
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The cost of wraith guards have been increased from SM2 to netepic gold (from 150 to 200). I was wondering what the reason for this price increase is. To compare the wraith guards to the squat robot see below:

Wraith guard:
Cost: 50 points
Move: 10 cm
Save 5+
Morale: -
CAF: +4
75 cm 5+ (-2)
25 cm 5+ (0)
Waystone

Robot:
Cost: 20 points
Move: 10 cm
Save 5+
Morale: -
CAF: +2
75 cm 5+ (0)
Inorganic, robotic, quickdraw

I don't understand what justifies the 2,5x cost of the wraithlord to the robot. So I don't understand why the price was increased from 150 points for 4 wraith lords to 200 points for 4 wraith lords. Looking at battle report and army lists the wraith lords are not a unit anyone favors with the current (high) cost. For the same cost you can get a falcon which is much better!

Ronnie


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 Post subject: Re: Cost of wraith lord
PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2016 6:26 pm 
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The Wraithguard's CAF is 2 points higher, its primary weapon is better (TSM), it has a secondary weapon, and it MUCH easier to control (so long as a Warlock is around, and even without one).

As far as the Points Formula is concerned, the two are about equal in value. The Squat Robot comes in at 43.05 points and the Wraithguard at 44.8 points. Use the Formula values for your armies. That will solve many problems.

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 Post subject: Re: Cost of wraith lord
PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2016 7:29 pm 
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I disagree. I think the wraith lord is much harder to control than robots (snipers, sniper special cards, tyranid cards etc. all remove the farseer and they all hell breaks loose) plus the quick draw is a very good ability the wraith guards dont have. But overall I think the wraithlord is better than a robot, but far from 2,5x as good.

But your point formula also says the two units should be similiar costed, so I am still trying to understand why the price was increased for the most expensive of the two compared to prices in SM2?

The point formula also points to them being overcosted while the 4 for 150 is closer to the point formula cost which they originally cost.

Ronnie


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 Post subject: Re: Cost of wraith lord
PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2016 11:12 pm 
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I think what you need to remember is that the inherent usefulness of a unit isn't always directly related to its stats. If a unit can give a given faction a fulcrum to launch a certain tactic around, that their forces would be ill suited to otherwise, then that unit is a lot more useful than a near identical stated unit in an army that has other units suited to that role.

Not saying that's the case here, but it could be.


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 Post subject: Re: Cost of wraith lord
PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2016 1:25 am 
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Good point Sayrewolf.

In addition, different players can (and do) have varying opinions as to what is useful and what is not. Thus, most likely whoever put costs to the Wraithguard (not ...lord) thought they are more useful than you do.

I should have been a little more specific. I have no idea why they were given those costs for Gold, as I was not involved with that. I was just trying to point out how the Wraithguard are better than Robots. Personally, I think that even without a Warlock present Wraithguard are easier to control than Robots are, as Robots require a "program" and cannot deviate from it. But that is just me. Obviously, different people have different opinions.

Seeing the values generated by the formula, I also agree that their Gold cost is wrong. Or the cost for Robots is wrong. Or both are wrong. However, that does not matter, as Gold is finalized and will not be changing, except for possibly a few errata bits here and there.

On that note, Squat Robots have a different Weapon loadout than all other instances of Robot. This bothers me as it seems to be an inconsistency. Why would Squat Robots be inferior to other Imperial Robots?

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 Post subject: Re: Cost of wraith lord
PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2016 3:57 pm 
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I agree that Wraithguard and Wraithlords are easier to control than Robots. Robots are very restricted in what they can do, and it isn't that easy to snipe Warlocks and/or Farseers, providing you are reasonably careful.

As for the costs, if you're unhappy with those, Magnus has pointed you in the right direction regarding an alternative points system, which you could use, since the costs for default NetEpic Gold are not going to be changed.

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