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NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File

 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 5:58 am 
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Matty_C wrote:
How much did the activation count difference come into play here?
If you had used the non-evolution rule set do you think it would have been so one sided. I know that's a difficult question to answer, but I'm thinking that the massive difference in activations is the issue, which is more important in evolution than in ne5/gold, so adjusting points to balance might be required in one system, but not so much in others.
Then again, army selection is going to be different now, as new units become viable, and other units become more valuable, depending on what the opponent brings, as their army selection changes too.
Food for thought anyway.
Edit: did you play that command units have to be activated along with a detachment? Things like that might make a difference, as well as taking a warlord in an activation count light army, against an activation count heavy army. :P


Good questions, both of which I can deal with in one handy answer!

There would have been more activations for both forces - even more so for IG - under Gold because Command Units get their own activations in Gold while in Evolution I had spotted quickly that forces with CUs such as Marines & IG have an activation advantage over the likes of the Eldar. It's in the Evolution rules that CUs MUST be activated along with one of the Detachments that they command. This also applies to all of those Commissars so you could easily add another 5 activations to IG under Gold.

Under Gold the IG still would have had a huge activation advantage in the movement phase (just as they did in Evolution) but what isn't as clear is whether the FF & Advance firing phases would have levelled the playing field much. My feeling is that it wouldn't have made much difference; from memory we both were firing everything on Advance on turn 1 while turn 2 saw more of a mix of FF and Advance firing from both forces. Possibly the Marines may have had a little better fortune under Gold in turn 2 because a lot of my forces were advancing which mean all of Craig's FFs would have fired before they got the chance to do so.

I'd invite Craig to share his thoughts on this in case I am playing this down, he may be more objective on this matter than me.

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 8:24 am 
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Thanks for the reply Bissler. Couldn't remember how Evo handled those small unit activations. That is a good fix you have in there.

I think army selection will be quite different with the new points, both in what you take because you think it works, and what you think you will need to counter your opponent. Both of these will be different now with the points value spread being different and relative quantities of units being different.

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 8:39 am 
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MagnusIlluminus wrote:
I actually have values worked up for the specific Black Legion formations, as I'm using that faction in an ongoing campaign. As of V0.325, they are:
Century: 325
Battle Century: 328
Assault Century: 284
Obliterator Squad: 56


Oops, I had a couple of errors in there, due to a calculation error related to the Obliterators. The Assault Century should cost 316 and the Obliterator Squad should cost 91.

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 10:25 am 
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Yep, i'd be inclined to agree with Gordon that if anything playing the Evolution rule set decreased the activation difference (although having never played vanilla NE Gold i can't say for sure)

I would have also thought the orders/tactics would have been fairly similar.

Yes, i'd be up for reversing it (gives me a chance to bring all my IG!)

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 5:44 pm 
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Craigm999 wrote:
Yep, i'd be inclined to agree with Gordon that if anything playing the Evolution rule set decreased the activation difference (although having never played vanilla NE Gold i can't say for sure)

I would have also thought the orders/tactics would have been fairly similar.

Yes, i'd be up for reversing it (gives me a chance to bring all my IG!)


I look forward to seeing your IG force for the rematch sometime hopefully in the not-too-distant future!

Btw, for anyone not in the know, Gordon is my real name.

@Matty C: no probs mate, happy to respond to any questions about Evolution. ;)

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2015 1:30 am 
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Hi!

The file has been completely updated to show original gold values, first formula tweak (3) and the current tweak 3.25.

http://www.netepic.org/uploads/2/2/1/0/ ... n_list.pdf

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2015 9:28 am 
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Big job that. Nice work.

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2015 7:43 pm 
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Matty_C wrote:
Big job that. Nice work.


Hi!

The heavy list was the original file, now it is much easier to update and change the headings.


It does make it easier to catch costs and units that need more work.

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 9:14 pm 
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Hi!

Cost comparison PDF has been updated and is available in the first post of this thread.

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 10:12 pm 
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This seems to improve with every update! While there may be some points that come up that I'll chip on and I know there's a lot of work still to be done I think this project is shaping up very nicely indeed!

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Thu Jul 09, 2015 7:22 pm 
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Hi!

Updated files to include 0.34 changes.

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Thu Jul 09, 2015 9:18 pm 
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I see what you mean! That's much more like it for a Capitol Imperialis! I approve!

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Wed Jul 15, 2015 12:07 am 
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The link in the OP seems to have reverted to the version that showed Gold, Tweak 3, and Tweak 3.25.

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Wed Jul 15, 2015 1:10 am 
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Hi!

Both old and new still there. Removed the old one.

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 Post subject: Re: NE 6 Revision Points Formula Comparison File
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2015 11:48 pm 
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Hi!

Latest updated file available here: http://www.netepic.org/uploads/2/2/1/0/ ... -19-15.pdf

The latest changes are quite impressive for the previously high priced units have been reduced in some cases substantially.

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